The Informed Customer?

Fernando of BA Cast brings up a great point about another difference between Argentina and the USA in his response to one of my posts.

"I don't know if Argentina is too efficient, but the customer-server communication works in a different way . One in which the former has a little more responsibility in informing his or her tastes, preferences, and recommendations...if you want a particular beer, it's up to you to ask: "¿have you got beer X, beer on tap, whatever?" if you order a piece of meat without clarifying anything, it comes "a punto" (is that "medium"? I always get lost with those scales)...if you want it some other way, you ask in advance."--Fernando

And I agree that the customer would need to clarify what they want when they order. My original point though was that in some of the more traditional cervecerías the only thing you get to choose is the size of the glass or the size of the bottle that you want to buy.


But, you get no choice as to the beer because they only have one.


In any case, his response did jar another point of difference that I had forgotten about.


A long time ago, one of my friends offered to help me replace the front door to my parents house. We went out and bought the door and obviously it came with everything. What I mean by everything is that it came with a door frame, knobs and a locking system, a door bottom, and a still for example.


Here you just get a door. It gives you the freedom to buy everything else and customize it, but you have to know that it´s going to be that way and you obviously need a little more knowledge if you are going to go about installing a door.


But this also extends to other things. For example, when I first got here and I looked around for unfurnished apartments to rent I was surprised by seeing the holes in the ceiling and the walls where there should have been light fixtures.


At the very most, sometimes there was a bare light bulb hanging by a wire.


When people bug out of an apartment or a house here they literally take everything with them.


As to Fernando´s experience with his first New York Bagel, he got me there. We do tend to want to create the biggest, and the best and are driven to include whatever can be included in a package. However, it might have been just a language/cultural misunderstanding.


You can order a plain bagel with nothing on it (exactly like that or a plain bagel, dry) and you should be able to get it. Or, you could order a blueberry bagel with nothing on it, etc.


When I started traveling to the states with my Argentine family I saw that they would try to order a toast, dry, but they did not know how. Since they started hanging out with me they have become experts at asking for dry toast.


So Fer, maybe one day we could find ourselves in New York and I would gladly go with you where you can order your 2nd New York bagel, and if you felt a little adventurous you wouldn´t be limited to a plain bagel.


No sir, you could try Blueberry, Poppy Seed, Onion, Apple Nut, Banana Nut, Cheese Pizza, Cinnamon Raisin, Cranberry Walnut Orange, Honey Oat, Jalapeño and Sharp Cheddar, Parmesan Basil, Pumperknickel, Spinach and Monterey Jack Cheese, Whole Wheat, etc.


I could go on for quite a while longer. And of course, Yanqui Mike lampooned that side of the USA quite accurately in his comment on our last post.


Maybe we could talk about it over a beer?

Customer-Server communication

Guest Post by Fernando of BA Cast:responding to my post "Is Argentina Too Efficient?"

OK, here's my move, Frank:

I don't know if Argentina is too efficient, but the customer-server communication works in a different way . One in which the former has a little more responsibility in informing his or her tastes, preferences, and recommendations...if you want a particular beer, it's up to you to ask: "¿have you got beer X, beer on tap, whatever?" if you order a piece of meat without clarifying anything, it comes "a punto" (is that "medium"? I always get lost with those scales)...if you want it some other way, you ask in advance.

I remember feeling like a moron in a bagel store in Manhattan, because I wanted A bagel. Un bagel. I wanted to try my first NY bagel, plain, a secas, sin nada, no toppings. How would I know how it really tastes if I attack it with cream cheese, bacon, eggs, peanut butter, chocolate? It took me three times to make the guy understand I just wanted A PLAIN BAGEL WITH NOTHING ELSE, NOT EVEN TOASTED. And it wasn't a language thing: the staff were all Spanish-speaking. They just wouldn't compute the request: "One bagel, please"...

If I want it with something on top, or toasted, or filled, it's in my interest to ask that. If they sell bagels, or beer for that matter, they should give me one. No questions asked.

In Truco language, I just gave my "Quiero Retruco", to your "Truco".

(Truco's a card game, that's all about teasing, lying and bluffing, like Poker but much, much funnier)

Is Argentina Too Efficient?

Seriously, I am not laughing as I type this.

Let me explain...

You go to a cervecería and you sit down and you order a beer, quite literally that is what you ask for and that is what you get.

This is an example:

mozo: Sí?

me: una cerveza por favor

mozo: chopp?

me: dale

(mozo is what you call waiters here in Argentina)


I could just say "un chopp" instead of asking for a beer and that would cut the conversation down by half!

And what is a chopp you might ask? It's a mug, or a glass. It's how you order beer on tap.

When I first came to Argentina I saw these "cervecerías" and I thought, great, they have beer joints!

I am going to be able to go in and find some varieties of beer that I have not yet discovered since I am from a different hemisphere away.

I wonder how many types of beer I am going to find....

One is the usual number of beer brand you would find at these places.

Fernando of BA Cast has a different point of view. Here is a recent conversation we had on the topic of "variety", his new pet peeve.

Fer: The thing's when you go to the supermarket and ask "where's the bitter?" and instead of pointing you to the alley, they ask you "what bitter do you want? Bitter sweet, bitter sour, bitter sour with a dash of sweet...decaf sweet bitter?"

Me: But, when you go to a "cervecería" here and ask for beer, it reminds me of repo man. There is only "beer", no asking what kind or anything.

Fer: Isn't that great?! Aren't you guys all about "getting to the point"? There you go...

Me: It's too efficient it's scary, it's almost anti Argentine the way it is so efficient. I mean you just sit and say beer and that's it, end of conversation.

At the very most the waiter would ask you if you want head on the beer or not when he serves it.

Also, it's not wine, serve the whole damned thing!

And so it goes. That conversation is still taking place by the way. Who knows where it will end up, but at the very least, we should continue it over beer, but at a real cervecería like Antares for example. 

Your move Fer...

BA Cast vs Me?

I seemed to have touched a nerve on my appearance on a fairly new podcast that has popped up in Buenos Aires. But, before I get to that maybe I should introduce you to this show.

Above all, it is entertaining, funny, witty, and they manage to do this even when they touch on serious topics. It never gets pedantic.

The hosts are Daniel Karlin (The American) and Fernando Farias (The Argentine).

Listening to them is like looking at the actual clash of cultures. It's like watching the melting pot get maid; a little of this, a little of that, mix in a dose of how things have always been with some "variety" (which happens to be Fernando's new favorite pet peeve thanks to yours truly and a little help from Daniel) and you get this show.

Some of the things you get to learn about would be the local´s courting ritual from the perspective of an expat woman in Baires on show 1, as well as how many alfajores are eaten on any given day in Argentina.

The number will shock you. Keep in mind the population is 40 million when you listen in on this one.

On episode three you have Maria Carra of Buenos Aires Foodies and Larry of El Tejano (my favorite salsa!) as guests talking about steak sandwiches.

For episode four Maria Carra comes back to give her top 5 DDL's and Yanqui Mike joins the conversation on socialism, unions, leftists, and the profit motive.

There is Ian Mount from Goodairs; a Canadian expat woman foils a bicycle robbery; they chime in on the culture of children; what do people do on the beach when they find a lost child and so many more little tidbits of life in Argentina.

Speaking of tidbits of life in Argentina they want to hear directly from you. On Tuesday, the 21st of December (yeah that´s tomorrow!) they are going to be at Sugar.

Go with your best story depicting a cultural or linguistic misunderstanding. The winner will get to be on their show. Daniel called his date "un gato" for example and not only did he live to tell the tale, he married her. That is one serious chamuyero.

Take my word for it. It´s a lot of fun taping with them. Which, leads me to my visit with them.

When I visited with them I took Diva, the sassy and mysterious beauty behind Bitch Tours, and she gave her top 5 questions that tourist ask her.

We had a blast chamuyando over wine, mate, cookies and brownies.

I was asked for my top 5 list and I could not think of one on the spot. Mine literally took days. Should I turn it in? Will I insult anyone with this?

I seemed to have touched a nerve with Fernando. Listen to him introducing the segment and you can´t help but see that I cut deep.

Here are my Top 5 mehs. These are things that Argentines think are fantastic, but I just shrug my shoulders and go meh.

You could also hear delight in Daniel reading them on the program.

Drumroll.......................

5. Quilmes - Yep, it´s Argentine´s Budweiser and that is not a compliment.

4. Churros - Just across the river in Uruguay you have great fresh churros. Why can´t they make them here like that? They have to put this awful fake chocolate covering on the churros and totally ruin it. Isn´t there a Spaniard among the population to help out? I can even get a better churro in the streets of Chicago with even more variety of fillings to boot.

3. Chimichurri - I was expecting a little heat, a blast of flavor that would bring out a party in my mouth when combined with steak. All it does is get in the way of a fabulous steak. Meh! Even they try to pass the blame on to the English (read the wikipedia entry).

2. Kiosco Alfajores - Not the premium variety, but those other ubiquitous hockey pucks of dulce de leche and cheap sandwich cookie covered in fake chocolate. Thankfully there are some great quality ones, but the massive consumption of the cheap variety makes them an Argentine staple and to me they are just meh.

1. Sandwiches de Miga - To me they are basically a wonder-bread sandwich with the crusts cut off. Yeah, I used to have those, when I was 5 years old.

So what do you think?

If you have not listened to the show you should fix that and give them a listen. The shows are very short. They run about 20 minutes short, just long enough to listen on a bus ride to and from work, date, doctor´s appointment, whatever. And if you hit un corte de calle, you can listen to two, three, four of them.

I have linked to the show all over this post. If you have iTunes you can also subscribe to the podcast.